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bluefloor
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:18 pm

I have been through one batch already and it went good. I am using about 270 F, it just seems like it would take many many weeks if I didn't. I just have to be sure to catch it and pull it off the heat at just the right time and then I will dry that 'jam' gently later. Then start digesting and see how the crystal thing works out. Like Nick said it will take many large jars to get enough to work with.

I am hoping the heat doesn't nill the process. If I used 130-150 F it might take 7-14 days just to get the spirit out of one jar. I just didn't see anything happening so I decided to go up. At least this way I know I can take sevearal atempts in a crucible soon and see if it works.

I know we would all like success soon. But as simple as these instructions are it still takes some real work , and time, to get it done.
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:10 am

Yes, I think the 270°F by which you distil off the spirit is good. But the problem as I see it is if you use a too high temp to evaporate the phlegm you get a black mass from which you won’t get any crystals. Therefore I use a pyrex dish at 140-150°F for easy evaporation in a toaster oven.

Frank
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:22 am

Hey guys,

have you noticed that the red „Jam“ after evaporation of the phlegm at 150°F hardens to a resinous material and when you again heat it up to 150°F in order to make sure it is thoroughly dried that it melts or gets wet and emits some liquid? How dry does it have to be and again how far can you move up the temperature?

Frank
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:34 am

Hi Bluefloor,
Well, I'm very impressed too, your apparel sounds sane & cheap.
Let me ask you: the distilling section of the pipe it's made of glass or plastic?
...And wich kind of plastic did you use for the refreshing section?
And, what did you use to join the parts, you use some kind of glue or silicone?
Or is this all glass?
Please give us some more technic info...

Zosimo
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PostSubject: heating resinous material   Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:28 am

Hi Frank,

I think that it's a tough call with how high you can heat the resinous material. Below please find some experiences (which may be helpful) I've had with the evaporation and sublimation of gw that has been sitting for some time. Note to the adventurous: this path has a pungent odor when doing this process, so if you do try something of this nature, please, for your own sake, start with a small amount so you can get a handle on it. You can mask the smell of it more easily that way.

When I was working on a Hollandus path (the one in Nick's book that mentions this work) last year, I found that overheating the gw resin allowed for some sort of yellow tinged salt compound (which, incidentally, reeks) to "sublimate" into a white fog in the neck and receiver...(disintegrate and reintegrate as crystals I think). Perhaps there is a similarity with what we get with dew but the yellow goes with the salt in this path. Once dissolved in the spirit of gw, the salts turn the liquid yellow. Lamentably, after a few distillations, I wasn't able to get it to dissolve silver as an alkahest, but I think I needed more ingredients which I didn't have on hand (see the path) or more evaporations to further alter the material. I ended up letting the path go due to the smell, but also because I didn't have enough space or sealed containers to store the liquids, and what I did store evaporated at room temperature over the course of a month (salt included).

Chrysopee can probably second the changes in state in the distillation part as he seems to have experience with this particular distillation (from what I remember in the I-A-O).

Regardless, the heat for this to happen at a significant rate was maybe around 400F, but there was clear sublimation at lower temps, maybe 300F? It was only just a little tiny bit though, and it is hard for me to remember, so please forgive if this is off a bit. I think that there may be more than one salt involved in the sublimation (but I could be wrong). The first salt seemed white, and after that a yellow compound seemed to be a part of the sublimated material. Finally, a very thick red material did also sublimate/evaporate in what looked like droplets starting at around 800F, but it was so intense that after my flask had cooled, I think it managed to cause cracks in the distillation arm, and now I have a souvenir. It also was not something I could completely dissolve with the other sublimated material unless it evaporated into the liquids or liquid salts. As Frank mentioned, the black, pitch-colored material left behind that does not sublimate does not appear to yield any crystals, and it is also very hard to get off of the glass.

All in all it's a fascinating path, and from what is evident with the salt and the red material distilling, it is likely that a super high heating in a kiln would cause the resins Frank has mentioned to sublimate or change into a volatile salt and the red liquid/gas in order to change the metals.

I hope this helps a little bit in terms of experimenting with how to dry the crystals (and to find how much is too much heat). I don't think that it's required to do all of this to make this dry red material have an effect on the metals, but perhaps it helps in making the effect more pronounced (that is just a supposition on my part at the moment as I have only used it for said purpose as is--dried).


Best of luck to all of you working on this or related processes. (I'd post photos of this if I had decent ones, but most are kind of blurry, I hadn't changed cameras yet).



sunny

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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:21 am

Ah, now I see the tin elbow made from coke tins... Laughing good idea indeed pirat!
But, please, explain more...

Zosimo
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:53 am

Hi Zosimo,

For the inner chamber I used soda cans at least for the first half. On the first model I used plastic bottles and it only lasted through one go as the plastic melted and deformed. For the outer chamber I used plastic cut from 2 liter soda bottles. I did not use them their original size, I cut them and rolled them up just a bit and then sealed them. For sealing all the joints I used silicon from a tube that is made for around bathtubs and sinks. It withstands the heat just fine.

On the inner chamber it is important that you seal it very carefully and with several layers so your spirit is not contaminated with cooling water. It took quite a bit of silicone as there were quite a few pieces put together. It also took many days for drying. I taped the pieces in place untill the silicone dried and just put more pieces on and more silicone each day. It is fed cooling water by 2 aquarium pupms, one pushing the water and the other pulling.

It is important to keep the inner chamber nice and wide so the vapors can easily float over to the cooling part. As big around as a soda can worked nice.
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:26 pm

Felix_Madhouse wrote:
Nick, do you think i'll be able to use a coin for this process, or would i need to break it down into something more easily dissolved by the GW, like a calx of silver?

The best thing to use is of course a calx of silver, finely powdered. But you can also just hammer a coin or thin bar out into a sheet so there is more surface area. The difference in the two methods is only in the speed at which the oil forms. With the calx, the oil forms in larger quantities and much faster. With the sheet it takes at least one hour to get just a little oil.

And then also the strength of your golden water will make a big difference on how well its able to dissolve the metal. I'm working on bringing the fast and simple path to perfection, where you just ferment the GW for 40 days in the sun and moonlight, then you filter and use the sunlight to make the oil of gold rise, and the moonlight to make the oil of silver rise to the surface. The tricky part is in the purification when you need to heat it up very hot to vaporize all the GW impurities that might have come over with the oil you absorb in the cotton ball.

Figuring out and easy way to do multiplications of this oil would be the ultimate gift from God. Imagine making a glowing oil without ever needing to do a single digestion or distillation. I doubt such a method is possible, but it sure would be wonderful if it was.
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Sat Mar 13, 2010 3:47 pm

∴N.D.C∴

If GW is left in the sun wont that cause bacteria and slime to grow in it? Should it perhaps be boiled for a few minutes first?
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Thu Mar 18, 2010 3:18 pm

After sitting for a month putrefying and fermenting, there's gonna be plenty of bacteria growing in already. The alcohol will sterilize it, and you heat up the oil to make it into the stone and vaporize everything else anyway. You heat it up almost to the melting point of lead. Then you dissolve the stone in water, and filter out whatever doesn't dissolve, so you are left with a near 100% pure stone when your evaporate the water.


Last edited by NDC on Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:23 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Wed Mar 24, 2010 11:10 pm

I began an GW experiment in early Feb/10. I was getting inspired by all during that time and had yet recieved the, Covenant of Silence. So knowing my methods might be incorrect, I proceeded anyhow for the Practical
Experience.
Below are 3 Jars, all within a week of each other
[img][/img]
From left to right;
1) Had a cold, no alcohol, some beets and cough syrup
2) Feeling better, Bottle of White Wine
3) Better, lots of Beets and Some Beer

Very surprising the difference in colours
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Wed Mar 24, 2010 11:32 pm

Had to check the upload, will proceed.

All 3 Jars were put into the Furnace room in different areas regarding temp. during Puterfaction. For this thread, I will be discussing only the First on left, the darkest.
[img][/img]
42 Days later, as you can see, being on the Hot Water tank, in winter. It has evaporated quite a bit from the Blowers' heat exhuast. And during this time a Precipitate showed up, I decided to isolate it before going further.[img][/img][img][/img]
I wondered if these were Uric Acid, not uncommon for GW.
Seperated, washed with Spirit of Thunder and dried.
[img][/img]
So many different shapes, sizes and colours.
[img][/img]
Tried putting different samples in Spirit of Thunder (7 times distilled)
kept in a warm room.[img][/img]
Nothing happened for 3 days until 2 of 4 samples had dissolved, after 5 days still the same. At day 7, (the baby jar was not covered) to my surprise, not considering it, the spirit had evapourated. The 2 samples were still there with this milky substance.
[img][/img]

So my Bretheren, any thoughts or explanations, as to what has occurred?
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Thu Mar 25, 2010 2:30 pm

Hi Kirk,
I'm starting again me too in these days to work with acqua pontica.
They look more or less like those crystals that are produced by evaporation of the matter, a little more dried & proteical sticky, but quite the same.
What a pity that you used that fatastic 7 distilled water!
Beacause that milky liquid you obtained it's always the same you can have heating this kind of crystals.
Look for more info about the ways to work with GW: study them together comparing the paths and traying to understand the tricks and the complications, the reasons and the powers that are working in it.
Love the work.

Zosimo
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:01 am

Hi Zosimo,
thanks for the advice, the work is certainly fun and it's great to actually to experiment. Look forward to getting proper equipment to use as the spring Dew season begins.
Yes, it will smart to try different methods and see the results of - I have learned much already - hard to beat real practice. Because of the mystery,
it feels like we all are the explorers of the 22 Century!

Best to all, Kirk
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Fri Mar 26, 2010 9:20 am

Kirk,

I'm glad to see somebody here noticed this. I've been gathering these little red rocks you posted an excellent picture of as well, and I too suspect it to be uric acid (possibly very useful). At first I thought that the crystals were insoluble in water until I let them sit for a couple of days and I got a beautiful irridescent film and obviously some of the material was dissolving which I could tell by a quick taste of the water. To me drinking this water seems to have an effect on the mind. If you eat these crystals you will get pimples or some kind of growths on your legs and face. I still do not know why.

I wonder why some of your samples dissolved and some didn't. I suspect that once the right water is highly saturated with this acid it may become an alkahest. I believe this is a wonderful stone to practice with and would love to hear any other thoughts or observations which you may make.

Kirk, I think these little red rocks are quite a bit different then the matter obtained by evaporation alone. Would you mind helping me out as far as what acqua pontica is exactly?
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:41 pm

Hi Field,
I still plan to seperate the GW Precipitate, in order to see how many different crystals are actually present. Is it Uric, Urea or potentially something else. I would be quite surprised if any were the prized crystals.
As I was taking some medicine, maybe they were simply flushed through my system. Bottles 2, and 3, have no precipitate at all.
Unless it is repeated, hard to really know for myself, unless someone else has further info. Maybe these crystals would just be left in the mix and discarded after following GW Method #3 distillation.

As for 'acqua pontica', checkout:
http://www.labyrinthdesigner.org/tag/aqua-pontica/

Great reference Zosimo! and when he mentioned the crystals may be a result of evapouration, I'm still not sure as 'my' end result can give an answer to that question.

See next post
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Fri Mar 26, 2010 3:03 pm

After removing crystals from GW#1, was very excited about distilling the Spiritum and beginning an evapouration, as there was a definite Cotton Ball

but then disaster struck!!!!
I knocked the bottle over and lost most of it. Not something to do in the house, luckily in basement next to the drain. Quite deflating.
[img][/img]
So I proceeded anyhow... and after reading here in the forum, of GW smell and potential boil overs and film, etc. I took it quite slowly with my homemade set-up.
[img][/img]
Man, does that stuff smell!!!!!!!!! I got it finished but not b4 gettin' crap from my sweetie... forbidden to do it again... inside!
Ah, the joy of learning.
[img][/img]
Managed to fully dry out the matter though I'm not sure the Cotton Ball
survived the fall and may have spilled.
[img][/img]
I may have cooked this too fast as the voice of reason was very mad scratch
[img][/img]
another example of Play-Doh... so professional
Crushed the Salts, mixed with Spirit and set into a tube as Wilfred once mentioned.
[img][/img]
So since I will not be doing anymore of this is house (GW) I have not purified this beyond filter, and just stuck it the snowbank outside (not freezing) 3 days so far no change. Not properly saturated for sure.

Sill in the Practice stage, need proper equipment and follow Nicks'
instructions proper.

May the Moon reflect Sun rays into your lives.
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:13 pm

Kirk,

Don't be too surprised. All of the work may have been done for you. I highly recommend that you investigate more the uric acid. It may be simpler than you think.

I have noticed that the uric acid crystals do not always form but I can share with you one secret. Ingest shilajit. Investigate the ability of uric acid to corrode gold. You may find distillation isn't necessary at all.
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Sun Mar 28, 2010 11:54 pm

Field,
Did some more reading and there sure seems room to explore with these
unexpected masses. And the shilajit is mighty interesting, thanks.



So I decided to take a closer at the test tube after a few days of sitting in snowbank out back covered from the sunlight. Added an equal volume of
Spirit of Thunder, let it digest 24 hrs and filtered 2 more times. An great amount of settiment came out.

Up close to a light, the Burgundy Brown appeared bright Blood Red.
So I took a picture
[img][/img]

Now it looks Purple, is it the camera?

It is now evapourating towards a supersatured mercury

Like an onion it unfolds
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:27 am

Holy Cow Kirk! That does look really purple. You mean that's your golden water and it looks purple now? Geeze how did you do that?? They've never told me anything like that was possible in chemistry class. You've stumbled upon something really remarkable here. I'd congratulate you but I feel so humble now.

I'd be interested to hear what research you came up with also. I'm not sure about my hunch but maybe the liquid and the solids are equally important and somewhat equivalent. The reason I let you know about shilajit is because if you take shilajit then the amount of uric acid crystals in your GW will skyrocket!

Well anyways, I still can't get over that picture man. That's amazing and thanks for uploading it because it really is kind of magnificent to behold. What a royal color Smile
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:22 am

Hi Field,
The Pic is definately fun to look at but I can't help wondering if it is just a
light spectrum trick because my eyes can't see the Purple. I took 2 more, using another source - the first was an incandecent and this one now is a halogen. It is strange that my eyes see red but not the purple.
[img][/img]
I suppose the real test will be once the solution is supersaturated, then our
desired crystals may sprout.
[img][/img]
Hopefully it won't take so long for the evaporation as I will be using the hot water tank as a heat source. No more GW heated in the HOUSE again!

Thanks for all the encouragement


Last edited by Kirk on Mon Mar 29, 2010 10:35 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : spelling)
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Mon Mar 29, 2010 12:39 pm

Yes Kirk, that is strange that you cannot notice it with the naked eye. In the picture it definitely looks purple even in the other light source. I think the camera is producing the correct colors. Wish I could see it in person. Hopefully your crystals sprout well and thanks again for this awesome update.
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Mon Mar 29, 2010 2:58 pm

Here are some details of the Test Tube Purpleness, if any is repetitive or obvious, excuse me. Being a new student, one doesn't leave out what might seem ordinary, just attempting to understand.

After distilling and preparing to dry the remaining matter, this is when Sweetie, woke up to the smell in house and freaked. I decided just to amp the heat and get over the drying process. I did not want to burn the Salts but I did boil the remainder. I think I lucked out at the right time of boiling to dry without burning.

Later, still knowing that evaporation must take place, I thought I'd try the
Sunshine distillation method but improvised to the stove (again she was sleeping)
[img][/img]
It was all working so perfrectly study
I left the kitchen and then... crack and WOW, the smell! She is awake and I'm in fsdafpsduf... again.
[img][/img]
A drop of condesation must have dropped and landed on the jar.
[img][/img]
So I lost half again... that's when I decided to stick it in the snowbank for 3 days and later add Spirit of Thunder, in order to later filter to now.

So I did some more research on Uric Acid and found this link:

http://tinyurl.com/yjsre3b

Do you understand this Field? Chemistry is not my strength.
It is a long shot but possibly enlightening.

Anyone else care to comment?


Last edited by Kirk on Mon Mar 29, 2010 3:02 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : fix URL)
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:53 pm

Hi Kirk,

drying takes a long time with such a small surface area. Ideal is a pyrex dish in a toaster oven at 65°C. If you amp the heat more you will burn it. Not before you have dried it to a gooey mass you can increase the temp. It took me 2 days experimenting in a warming oven to find out the exact temp. when it is completly dried. Because when you half dry it and leave it open over night the substance becomes wet again because it is deliquescent.

Frank
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PostSubject: Re: GW Method 3   Fri Apr 02, 2010 5:31 pm

My golden water is almost ready for the process nick has shared. I plan on makeing the white stone first and I wish to know, will the oil only rise during the full moon? I would think it wouldn't matter as long as the moon shines on it but it might not produe oil quickly if there isn't much moon light. Once I have enough of the white stone I can then make the red stone as nick suggests.

I've also observed some unusual things with the prime materias i've left to ferment. 3 are from the human source. One was gw left in the sun and moon for a philisophical month as nick has also suggested. After 2 weeeks the glass jar, which wasn't on a hot surface nor was it sealed, suddenly cracked. Has anyone had this happen? I assumed there must be a logical explanation but I can't help but wonder if the philosophical dew absorbed so much power the glass vessel couldn't contain it?
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